Some real world times (not certified!)

Discussion in 'Carry Issues & Self Defense' started by ADulay, April 15, 2012.

  1. All,

    Well, it's a slow day so I had some free time to play with my new toy.

    Yes, I broke down and bought a shot timer. Got the Competition Electronics Pocket Pro 2.

    So I was at the range by myself. Just enjoying some comfortable shooting and getting a real time on my draw from the holster instead of just guessing that "it's about 2 seconds" from timer to target.

    As it turns out, it's darn right close to that.

    From my normal open carry (and concealed carry) holster, the time to draw and HIT the target at 15 yards varied from 1.05 to 1.75 seconds. That was for 20 shots out of two magazines.

    Both the G30 (in 45ACP) and G34 (in 9mm) had those times so my initial "guess" that both guns worked and handled the same were correct.

    Now, for the important stuff and the reason for this particular message.

    From time to time I get into, well, spirited conversations about the advantages of open carry vs concealed carry and especially pocket carry in particular. You've all heard the relevant arguments. Open carry deters the threat. Concealed carry allows for the element of surprise. Both have their proponents.

    Anyway, once I was done with the draw and shoot phase (random starts) I decided to see just how much time it takes for my pocket carry Walther PPK/S in the leather pocket carrier.

    The argument that you can be "ready" just as fast by concealing your carry does not hold up, at least in my unscientific "study".

    From a random starting tone, it took anywhere from 3.07 to 4.50 seconds to draw and fire the weapon on target.

    That's a BIG difference in times and remember that this is from a "non-panic" standing start. There also was no bad guy coming at me during all this. It was all from a random start to bullet on steel.

    Now think about how far away a person has to be to be able to get to you in 3.5 seconds. THAT's how much space you need if you conceal carry in your pocket!! Throw in a reaction time to identify the bad guy and the fact that he is about to do bad things to you and the space around you becomes VERY large!

    The ability to draw and engage in 1.5 seconds vs 4.0 seconds is an eternity in a life or death situation.

    The bottom line is that I'm really glad I finally bought a decent shot timer. I'm very happy with it and it has allowed me to confirm some suspicions about "real world" times for drawing and engaging a threat. Can I draw faster than that? Yes. But the key is to draw, engage and HIT the threat, not just make noise quickly. That's why the test were done at 15 yards and not at 5 or 7 yards. 7 yard times would be faster due to just drawing and shooting on the point. No need to bring the gun up to eye level. This would also make the differences in time between open carry and pocket carry even larger!

    So, although I'm just messing around with the new timer, it allows me to confirm things.

    I got to practice my "Glock The Plates" stage (GSSF shooting) and I must be doing something right as I'm beating my best GSSF times by a lot now, all because I KNOW the real times now and not just estimates in my head!!

  2. Very nice post AD. I am glad you posted this official or not. It's kinda of scary to me that you can save that amount of time just with open carry. I suppose I need to start open carrying more around here as well.

    Sorry about the late response I've been out of town for a while.
  3. All,

    Not to belabor the point, but the never ending "argument" between concealed and open carry never ceases to amaze me.

    What I honestly believe is that a lot of people will not open carry mainly because they don't want to appear to be "out of place" or "that odd guy down the street" or any of a few dozen different scenarios that would make you think you're some kind of odd duck for open carrying.

    I'll mention it here as I believe I may have already stated this in another thread but once you really get comfortable with open carry, you will wonder how in the heck you ever got around with full time concealed carry.

    I thought my pocket carry and trick/custom (and expensive) IWB concealed holsters (to include the CrossBreed models) were the cat's meow until I went open carry. Now it just drives me nuts to have to hide the gun in my pants.

    But I digress. The mere fact that REALISTIC draw and shoot times are much faster from an open carry.

    Need to test one more thing? How about trying to run away from a bad guy and draw your weapon.

    Not just back away, but RUN away (to avoid the shoot) and see how that goes!!


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