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Is anyone else following Ares Armor?

PrepperTraining

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#1
This is some really scary stuff. Not much about the actual ATF break in on Fox News, but there are a couple youtube videos of teh ATF breaking in. NutnFancy also has a long (48 minutes) video about it - still watching that.

Background info from Fox News
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2014/03/1...turn-over-customer-list-to-federal-officials/

Summary of current situation (as of Saturday 3/15/2014) (3:11)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WKNzj9kk4lQ

ATF Breaking in the door (3:13)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pRQ3Yk-th0E

ATF Cracking open the safe at Ares Armor (6:18)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6KFjjLXDZ4E

Video from outside the store (1:19)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6gsmlJSpWvk
 
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#2
I have been following this. It really pisses me off the say the very least. Enough so that I ordered 20 shirts which I had "*uck the ATF" printed on and will be getting some local friends of mine to do a video short video displaying the shirts, shooting our guns, and then giving the finger to the camera. Just to show our asses and tell them what we think.
 

diesel

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#3
Every one of those commie bastards and who ever ordered this illegal search and seizure should be arrested, tried, and summarily hung.
This shit is get'n worse every day. We've, somehow, got to put a stop to this.:cuss: :flag:
 

PrepperTraining

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#4
You know, one of the things I was thinking about is that the local cop standing out front, Maybe even the guys actually breaking in may be constitutionalists, but just not aware of the situation. I wonder if they knew they were violating a court order. It looks like they came in the early morning before anyone was there to resist them. I'm not familiar enough with how much information the police get before they go in, Are they gonna have all the information around the events leading up to the break in?
 

whitewolf68

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#5
I read that they had the TRO amended so that it was legal search and seizure. I agree with the rest of you that this is getting stupid to say the least. The government is making up rules now as they go along. 80% lowers are NOT considered firearms according to the law despite what they claim. I personally think this was a name and address grab by them.
 
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#6
^ Could have been. From what I read, the ATF had their panties in a bunch over one specific set of polymer lowers. The ATF thinks that they were complete receivers, which then had the spaces that would need to be milled by the customer filled back in with another color of polymer to make these lowers virtually almost un-*uck up-able. To the unknowing mind, this seems legit. The problem is that the way the ATF sees it, once a chunk of material has been made into a receiver (by legal definition the firearm itself), it is always a firearm until it has been destroyed. Which means you cannot simply make a complete receiver, and then fill the holes and such back in with welds, or plastic, or whatever. You absolutely have to torch cut it into 3 pieces, or melt it down.

What this all means is that as far as the ATF is concerned, the company who manufactured the lowers, and the retailer (Ares Armor) have been engaging in commerce of firearms. Neither of them have license to do so. So the ATF came down with their mighty hammer. Depending on exactly how the manufacture process of these "80%" lowers goes, the ATF has a case. Weather it's bull shit or not (and we all know damn well it is) the law is in black and white. But I still stand behind my 'FTATF' stance.


Just to brighten up everybody's day though:
 

PrepperTraining

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#7
HOLY COW!! Not only is that a gun in his ear, HE HAS HIS FINGER ON THE TRIGGER!!

Guess it's just another dose of chlorine to the gene pool...
 
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#8
^No kidding!

If what the owner of Ares Armor says is true... They have one HELL of a potential lawsuit on their hands! According to them, the lowers in question are NOT made complete and then filled back in with plastic, the plastic you see filling the area needing to be milled is actually an insert which the lower receiver is molded around. I do die casting for a living (the difference being that I cast molten aluminum, these people use molten plastic). I have actually run a few dies that use the exact same principle of making a casting around solid plugs of material. If this is how it is done, the ATF has no case, and Ares Armor can sue the living shit out of them!

See here:
http://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/20...rview-ares-armors-dimitri-karras/#more-305207
 

whitewolf68

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#9
That was a very good read and it will b interesting to see how this whole mess evolves. Thank you for the article.
 

diesel

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#10
I agree with the Wolf, good read, BUT, i'd bet they'll lie their commie asses off to get away with it just like Fast + Furious.
These bitches need to be brought down to earth and realize they eff'n work for US!
In my humble O, it's git'n closer and closer to the time we're just going to have to TAKE OUR country back.:cuss:
GOD BLESSAMERICA! :flag: :flag: :flag:
 
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#11
Well think about people legal or not this is just about how evil gun owners are. They will try to show that we will do everything possible to own an AR. It's not about the Law it's about us EVIL GUN owners and your right to bear LEGAL firearms. If it was up too them BB GUNS would be illegal.
 

ADulay

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#12
Well, a long time ago I bought one of these shirts.

I even wear it out to the range every now and then for our Monday night stuff.

AD

 

whitewolf68

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#14
Very interesting read that was. It appers to me that the ATF is making the laws as they go along. I thought according to the law that 80% lowers were not considered firearms until further machined and able to accept upper receivers.
 
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#15
Manufactures Name and Serial Number are they there or NOT?

Do the 80% receivers have a name and serial number on them as required by federal law?
~
From what I have read ATF is stating the lack of manufactures name and serial number for tracking purposes as their reason for seizure of the receivers. If they don't have what is required by law as stated, how they are molded is a moot point, right or wrong without the necessary stamped information on the receiver they are illegal and Ares Amour seems to be silent on that subject and very loud on the molding process.
~
Seems to me this is being played up as more than what the facts will support. :banghead:
~
I am all for our rights under The Constitution and our privileges under the law. But we must work within the law if we are to ever to be accepted by the citizens of the US as working in their best interest. If a company is caught with their pants down then they need to be penalized for their infractions and bear the consequences. I believe this is a case that someone got caught breaking the law and is trying to make a Constitutional matter out of it to raise support amongst 2nd Amendment advocates.
~
As advocates we must be cautious about being drawn into an illegal matter that isn't directly related to our 2nd Amendment cause. :D
 

PrepperTraining

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#16
Re: Manufactures Name and Serial Number are they there or NOT?

Dogshawred - According to the ATF website, the receiver is not a weapon until it is completed. That's the point to lowers that are 80% milled. They're not complete and so they aren't a weapon. Since they're not a weapon, they don't need a serial number. They're only a piece of metal that is 80% of the way to being a weapon.

Here is an interview with the owner interview with the owner of Ares Armor that goes into more detail.

From what I've been hearing, this is a case where a reseller was abiding by ATF rules, and ended up unjustly being targeted. Even the ATF's reply to the TRO is bogus. This action will probably drive the company out of business. It is NOT in the public's interest. As others have said, this could be just an attempt to grab a list of names for customers. Possibly just another attempt at intimidation by the ATF.
 
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#17
Re: Manufactures Name and Serial Number are they there or NOT?

SUPPOSEDLY,an employee was taking the 80% receiver and the customer that purchased it,into the back room to the machining facilities and showed the purchaser how to use the equipment to finish the receiver. The end result was that the customer was walking out with a finished,non-serialized,unregistered lower out of a gun store. A no-no per laws.
 

PrepperTraining

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#18
Re: Manufactures Name and Serial Number are they there or NOT?

Yup, that would be a no-no. I wouldn't even have that kind of equipment on site.
 
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#19
Re: Manufactures Name and Serial Number are they there or NOT?

Again another part of the story pops up that begins to clarify what was really happening, I find reality is a cruel mistress.
~
When you don't know the full story, we are all just guessing at the what is right and what is really right.